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BenjaminHester (1035 D)
11 Aug 17 UTC
(+5)
obsolete Sengoku variant
Hi all, designer of Sengoku here. I would love to get the latest version of Sengoku in use on this system, as it is much more balanced. Found here: http://dipwiki.com/index.php?title=Sengoku
Even if the DP system, can't be used, the version at http://nairenvorbeck.angelfire.com/ is still better than the one in use currently. Poor Mori needs a fair chance :-) Anyone willing/able to help me get these implemented?
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CCR (1957 D)
11 Aug 17 UTC
(+2)
Hi Ben, how good to remember the birth of all your "children" -the old times of DVW- and now see them growing mature!

If the Diplomacy Points system could one day be coded, it would be useful for other variants too, such as Versailles and others that introduce the concept of Major and Minor powers. We had a brief discussion of it when I brought here the idea of 1200 Crusades with Majors and Minors.

CCR from the DK's of ACD
Hi Cristiano! very good to hear from you again. I loved the DP system, found that it added an easy to learn mechanic that made Diplomacy, well, more Diplomatic...particularly in historical scenarios with minor powers/city-states. It probably would work very well with 1200 Crusades indeed. Hopefully someone knowledgeable about implementation will help us here.
RUFFHAUS 8 (2490 D)
11 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
Thanks for stopping in with your updated variant, Ben! Sengoku has been getting a lot of attention at VDip lately with a couple of gunboat tournaments. I suppose since you've revised the map, there's little value in analyzing the results for trends that may have matched up with your previous findings. And since the games were all no-press games, it's further difficult to base changes on them, but it might be worth a look at the results anyway. Wasn't there once a version with standing neutral armies? There is a coding developed to accommodate those in use here. Anyway, stay a while, and play a game or two. It would be great to have you.
zurn (1178 D)
11 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
"Wasn't there once a version with standing neutral armies?"

Isn't that the current vDip version?

Great to hear there was further development done on Sengoku. Yes the Mori have no favours done to them, as is obvious from the vDip stats. http://www.vdiplomacy.com/stats.php?variantID=27

It would be great to see new variants/versions coming in to vDip once more.
BenjaminHester (1035 D)
11 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
Rev 5 (the version currently in use on vDip) does indeed have neutral armies. Rev 6 made significant map boundary redraws and increased the starting position for each player to three units. Rev 6DP added the ability to influence the neutral armies to hold or support (as described here: http://dipwiki.com/index.php?title=Sengoku) - a very simple and easy to learn rule that nonetheless *greatly* improved the balance of the variant, particularly in Mori's favor (Chosokabe and Shimazu both have roughly equal incentive now to work with Mori, instead of against them.)
interestingly, Rev6 and Rev6 DP are not new at all, both have been out for years. I'm afraid Oliver (who graciously did the original implementation) simply might not have been aware of it at the time he ported Sengoku in to vDip (which I nonetheless am very grateful for)
Also, a big hi to Randy as well! I did get useful info out of the statistics to be sure - more Sengoku has been played here than anywhere else that I am aware of, thus my desire to ensure the best version of the variant is available *here*
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
11 Aug 17 UTC
(+4)
Just checked this thread as I dis some database-cleanup.
I might have some time to get the latest version implemented here... Nothing promised, but I'll take a look.
Hi Oli! That would be awesome if possible, and greatly appreciated. Mori players would surely be grateful :-) I'm leery of completely eliminating Rev5 though, as it is familiar to a lot of players here, and not everyone might love the DP system.
G-Man (2466 D)
11 Aug 17 UTC
(+2)
One of my favorite variants. Would love to play the new more balanced version.
Thanks G-Man! obviously love to hear feedback like that. Have you tried any of my others? (Dark Ages is probably the second most popular to Sengoku)
G-Man (2466 D)
11 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
I know I've seen your name on a few of these variants, but I'm not sure which others? I have tried Dark Ages and found it to be solid, but not as outstanding as Sengoku Jidai (which has beautifully artistic and highly functional usage of seas). In Dark Ages, I thought Ireland and Sweden had a little too much going for them, the mainland wasn't used that well, and the variant lacked a little mystery. But I love the concept. Also, looking over the new version of Sengoku Jidai, I hope it's color-coded upon implementation, as that has much better playability.
tantrumizer (1557 D)
11 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
I played in one of the Sengoku tournaments and enjoyed it. A more balanced version of it would be awesome!
I echo G-Man and tantrumizer's sentiments. It is a thoroughly enjoyable variant.
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
13 Aug 17 UTC
Hi Ben, the files from at http://nairenvorbeck.angelfire.com/ are the V5 files, not the V6?
So do we have an even older V5 version here? Would it make sense to use the V5-files from angelfire.com or the V6-files without the DP-rule?
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
13 Aug 17 UTC
Ahh, forget it. The Zip says V5, but the files in there are V6...
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
13 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
Another question. Is there a map with all the territory-names written on the map available?
Sorry about the delay! just got back from vacation. The V6 files are available at http://dipwiki.com/index.php?title=Sengoku. I don't have a map with the full names displayed (dipWiki has a blank image, and one with the territory abbreviations), but could probably turn one out with the full names fairly easily if needed.
Here's the link to the map with names:

https://1drv.ms/i/s!ArgdRV7UzPxGgQhjb1T_5-71kruq
one other small note - the V6 files do *not* work (i.e. are horribly unbalanced) without the DP rules (copied below)

Every spring and fall, each player in the game receives 1 Diplomacy Point for each SC controlled (up to a maximum of 3) to use to influence the actions of the neutral units on the map. Each season, players may submit up to three orders (hold or support only) for the various neutral units as if they were their own, and assign up to 2 of their total DP points to each order. During adjudication, the order that received the most total DP points for each particular unit is carried out. Any other orders submitted with fewer DP points are not carried out, and those DP points are lost. A unit must receive at least 1 DP point to execute an order. Units receiving no DP points hold. Neutral units, like any other, may have their support cut by an attacking unit, and may be supported to hold by other neutrals or players. Neutral units are *not* subject to the self-dislodgement rule - meaning that a neutral unit *may* support a player to dislodge another neutral unit. (i.e. each neutral unit is treated like a separate player). Neutral units are disbanded immediately if dislodged, but rebuilt at the end of the year if the territory is not occupied. Once occupied, the territory becomes a standard SC, and never reverts to a neutral again.
if this is impossible to implement, please let me know, there is one other option.
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
25 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
Hi Benjamin.
The DP rules are not impossible, but I might not have the time to implement this.
It's a rather large change to the rules-engine. I would really like to hear the other option. Maybe I can try to implement DP later...
BenjaminHester (1035 D)
26 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
Okay I'll take a look at it next week. It will most likely entail a full map overhaul, but I kind of wanted to do that anyway. Probably a later time period snapshot when Chosokabe, Asakura, and Takeda are removed, and a super-Oda faces off against rivals north and south. It will be a very interesting dynamic to try and balance, but I think I can do it.
might take a little longer than a week, but that's because i'm trying something more ambitious - an asymmetric variant. more to follow, but thought I would drop that little teaser now.

also a question - of course I will want to playtest this after the initial design is complete, and will almost surely make some revisions based on player feedback. Should I do that process in play-by-email games elsewhere, or is it okay to implement the variant in VDiplomacy and then make minor adjustments to it as players give feedback?
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
30 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
I think it's no problem to improve a variant over time. It's just a problem because the statistic will include all minor-variants in one big chart...
ah, okay - I may run a few off-vDip playtests before we implement then. I found the statistics extremely useful in the revision process thus far, and don't want to skew them. This new variant (tentatively named, Sengoku: Nagashino) should definitely be considered a standalone from the original Sengoku, and it will be massively different. As it stands, the player count shrinks to five (easier to fill), the map is completely redone for historical accuracy and balance, and as alluded to earlier, Oda will be the lone central power, but begin with significantly more SCs than the other players, and have a toehold on both N/S coasts. I think the asymmetric play is really going to offer a new experience both in tactics and diplomacy. Fringe daimyo will have to court the Oda clan while they grow to challenge them, and the Oda for their part have to leverage the credible threat that they can destroy at least one of their rivals single-handedly, although an alliance of all four will bring them down. Not too many variants make sacrificing some of your starting SCs a viable strategy, but the chaos builds and SC distribution should yield that result for Oda here. (which captures the historical aspect of awarding territory to loyal retainers well I think.)

okay, that was a wall of text. Clearly I'm excited about this. It's going to be great.
the current challenge: Oda's historical position in 1575 is much closer to his northern rivals (Uesugi/Hojo) than the south (Mori/Shimazu) so I will have to carefully craft sea zones and consolidate smaller/less historically significant provinces to artificially "shrink" that distance. E.G. If Oda can't reach Shimazu as quickly and easily as he can reach Hojo, then the Oda opening strategy will be imbalanced.

Historical note - Hojo actually was the last of the major daimyo to be pacified by Oda's successor, Toyotomi Hideyoshi. So there is some precedent for doing this.
Oli (977 D Mod (P))
30 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
It's different, and it will get new stats. But if you change something later on, the stats will not reset with each minor change...
G-Man (2466 D)
30 Aug 17 UTC
(+1)
Fascinating setup Benjamin. Just wish you'd have at least six powers, as the diplomacy and movement dynamics become much more interesting with 6-15 powers.
I agree G-Man. There is value in having two "triangles" so to speak in a six player game. I am exploring an option that adds the Miyoshi Clan of Awa and Kawachi rather than closing the distance between Oda and the southern daimyo, but this will make the variant even more difficult to balance I think. We'll see.

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89 replies
Grahamso1 (1912 D)
26 Nov 17 UTC
Extending the pre game time
Is it possible to extend the time while waiting for players in a game I created? If so how? Thanks
3 replies
Open
Enriador (1507 D)
19 Nov 17 UTC
(+1)
It's time to talk about Scoring
Hello all!

Let's talk about scoring? More specifically, about whether the dreaded Points Per Supply Center (PPSC) scoring should remain an option?
98 replies
Open
Major Problems (1364 D)
23 Nov 17 UTC
(+1)
1 v 1 games on variant maps
I am not a coder (sic) so I was wondering how hard is/was it to code 1 v 1 games? Is it reasonable to think that variant maps (Modern, Ancient Med, etc) could be set up to create 1 v 1 games? The idea of having a larger group of countries to play against each other is intriguing. I just don't know if it possible, or doable.
2 replies
Open
Grahamso1 (1912 D)
22 Nov 17 UTC
(+2)
How old school are you?
I am not very tech savvy so forgive me. I think I started dip on some RSS pages using Netscape at work in maybe 1996(?) does that make sense? All email based through Judges. What were they called? USDJ or something. I remember FROG but they all spoke French. Haha. I used to stand outside my office in the snow smoking a cig with a hand drawn map with about 100 crossing out for each phase using coloured pens. Ah web based interactive maps?!?! Luxury!!!
5 replies
Open
Jamie_T (895 D)
20 Nov 17 UTC
Notices
The notices on my front page are all jumbled up in a random order. PMs from weeks ago are at the top, and some of my game messages from the past day or two are lower down. Is anyone else noticing this?
9 replies
Open
Enriador (1507 D)
09 Oct 17 UTC
Napoleonic Variant, and the lack of neutral centers
I had the honor to play 'Napoleonic' back in the lab (an awful game as Spain by the way). I had a question back then which I ask here and now:

Why there are no neutral supply centers?
23 replies
Open
The Ambassador (1948 D (B))
20 Mar 17 UTC
Fixing the Pirates variant
With the new Lab up and running, as discussed in the DiplomacyGames podcast I'm keen to iron out the bugs in Pirates that people hate...
51 replies
Open
jason4747 (1633 D)
20 Nov 17 UTC
"Biggest Game of All Time Completed"- worth a look
http://webdiplomacy.net/board.php?gameID=205586
By the nice people at WebDip.
Pot: 31,500  - Spring, 1918, Finished - Germany dominates at 17
10 replies
Open
The Real Wheat (969 D)
16 Nov 17 UTC
New Maps
I'm super new to the site and I was curious how new maps were made and/or submitted. I noticed a lot of the maps look a bit old and it got me thinking about what it would take to create a higher resolution version of a game map. Are there certain file formats a map must be in or is this all a responsibility for site admins only? Thanks!
11 replies
Open
Major Problems (1364 D)
17 Nov 17 UTC
Imperium Diplomacy
Under the variants, I noticed one called Imperium Diplomacy, but was not able to create a game using this variant. Is it a discontinued variant, or under a different name? It looks like an interesting one, especially the beginning turns.
5 replies
Open
DemonOverlord (910 D)
07 Oct 17 UTC
Vdip colour scheme
Hi, I think vdip would be more successful with a different colour scheme. Also less painful to look at.
31 replies
Open
rebecca02 (1000 D X)
15 Nov 17 UTC
locks of hair
Beautiful.
1 reply
Open
JECE (1534 D)
10 Nov 17 UTC
Custom phase bug
This might be better in the Mods section, but I thouht I'd post here first to see if other users have any input.

I'm trying to create a new game with a custom phase length. When I select "Custom" from the drop-down menu, nothing happens. However, when I select "2 days, 2 hours", I've given the option to input a phase length. Hopefully this is an easy fix.
3 replies
Open
KingCyrus (1258 D)
01 Nov 17 UTC
WWII Update Errors
Hello, I am currently in a game of WWII and I was just informed that it has been updated, "fixing" problems with dual coasts. This supposedly means that Palestine now has two coasts. However, I have a fleet in the Red Sea and it can no longer move to Palestine! Please fix?
1 reply
Open
RUFFHAUS 8 (2490 D)
20 Oct 17 UTC
(+1)
Replacement Player(s) Needed
I need replacement players game sitters for several games:
13 replies
Open
peterlund (1080 D)
30 Sep 17 UTC
I have reported 2 Issues for vdiplomacy to kestasjk/webDiplomacy
Bug 1: "Turn limited vDip games should end after possible retreats" (Issue 261)

Bug/Questions 2; "How does vDip decide who the winner is?" (Issue 262)
17 replies
Open
BenjaminHester (1035 D)
25 Oct 17 UTC
(+1)
not quite ready, but... SE Asia 800
going to refine Balkans 1860 and Sengoku: Nagashino as needed before trying to implement this one. Thought I would just give y'all a peek behind the curtain. Thoughts welcome! (it has a few known imbalances to address, but it's close.)

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2CiokzfWGBhTlU0QTZZNzNrUEU
6 replies
Open
Jamie_T (895 D)
04 Oct 17 UTC
(+4)
MAFIA 1 - GAME THREAD
This is the game thread for vDip Mafia, Episode 1

Please DO NOT post in this thread if you are not playing in the Mafia game.
1560 replies
Open
Flame (1073 D)
23 Oct 17 UTC
Austrian question once again!
Please help with testing a map "War of Austrian Succession"
http://lab.diplomail.ru/board.php?gameID=51

Fast gunboat.
1 reply
Open
Flame (1073 D)
05 Oct 17 UTC
(+1)
Classic 1898 Variant adaptation
I do the adaptation for 1898 variant. Who knows the author of the variant to mention him in the description. Or it's Hasbro itself?

http://lab.diplomail.ru/board.php?gameID=43
7 replies
Open
Tactics
In year one when you just meeting everyone, maybe there anonymous but for sure you don't know any of them. How do you know who to trust?
They can be lying through their teeth and text doesn't show tone of voice or eye contact so you have no idea. If you believe them they may stab you. If you don't you venture into a DMZ and piss them off. Ask around to others and you get rumors or nothing. This game seems so much better suited to face to face.
15 replies
Open
Enriador (1507 D)
17 Oct 17 UTC
Classic Mini-Tourney - Is there interest?
I thought about making a mini-tourney - comprising a single game - using a similar scheme to most Face-to-Face scoring systems.

Basically it'll be a Classic game, running until Fall 1907 and a PPSC structure. The bet would be 100 points - for a ultimate pot worth 700 points.
26 replies
Open
Grahamso1 (1912 D)
13 Oct 17 UTC
Unable to enter certain orders. How to contact GM
Can someone help. I am playing one of the odder variants. New for me. I’ve read the variant page repeatedly and seems I ought to be able to enter a certain order. But it’s not available as an option. (Maybe I’m missing something. Or maybe a bug). Emailed the mods. But how do I contact GameMaster min a gunboat game?
Thanks
2 replies
Open
The Ambassador (1948 D (B))
09 Oct 17 UTC
(+5)
I love vDip
Enjoying this new golden age of variant development.

Hat tip to Oli and those building variants and supporting their development in the background.
5 replies
Open
FafevPlinskv (1039 D)
10 Oct 17 UTC
Taking over
Need help with a gunboat game, good position but sadly don't have time for it for a moment. PM for more details
0 replies
Open
The Ambassador (1948 D (B))
08 Oct 17 UTC
Napoleonic
Hey, where are the neutrals?

;-)
0 replies
Open
Jamie_T (895 D)
10 Sep 17 UTC
vDiplomacy Forum Mafia
Would anyone be interested in playing forum based Mafia / Werewolf here, on the vDip forum?
154 replies
Open
Enriador (1507 D)
04 Oct 17 UTC
Reliability system
I looked over Google but couldn't find any topic explaining the reliability system - can anyone hand out an example, and explain how noobs are handled? Thanks a lot in advance!
10 replies
Open
nopunin10did (1041 D)
19 Sep 17 UTC
Win Conditions less than majority
Some of you with a bit more experience at vDip can clue me in here.

How does vDip currently adjudicate when more than one player meets the SC requirement for victory simultaneously? More details below.
38 replies
Open
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